SHA Small Heath Alliance

El Mayor

Gavlaaa40

Sheep2

I was thinking more of assistants coming in below him or alongside at most, not above.
That is if he stays.

I think it would be an issue anyway whoever is director of football. . I'm not sure how bigger clubs do it, but Liverpool must have had different people working on the multiple transfers last Summer with the top team supervising rather than trying to negotiate all the deals.

If we want to be a big club we need more very competent people at all levels. Attempting to run lean would be a mistake. You don't get the best out of people by overworking them (except very occasionally in short bursts).

Genuinely not sure if he does a good job or not but this thread has led me down a rabbit hole looking at how we set up behind the scenes and it appears as though the 2 men who would be closer to transfers than CG are Joe Carnell (head of recruitment) who directs the day-to-day scouting infrastructure and analytical profiling of transfer targets & Steve Spencer (Head of first team recruitment) who coordinates the statistical model for assessing incoming players, both descriptions have been lifted from Google.

For reference CGs role is described as this "oversees the club's overarching football strategy, data-led talent acquisition, and performance departments".

He has been DoF for nearly 18 months now and in that time we have achieved cat 1 status at the Academy, won League 1 and achieved our best league finish in over a decade, would any of that happened without him? probably yes, but it still happened with him at the club so you have to give some credit to him for that.

There are obvious issues within the club that need fixing, i read earlier in the thread that you need to give a DoF 3-5 years before you can truly judge their performance as a whole and if CG goes i would assume more changes would follow as you would still have those directly below him doing the same jobs and we would still be using the same data software that we currently do, presumably if the club decides they want him to go they will want to revamp it all, basically there are many more layers to this than i first thought.

There are no simple answers. Ever.

Fat Buddha OBE

Sheep2

I was thinking more of assistants coming in below him or alongside at most, not above.
That is if he stays.

I think it would be an issue anyway whoever is director of football. . I'm not sure how bigger clubs do it, but Liverpool must have had different people working on the multiple transfers last Summer with the top team supervising rather than trying to negotiate all the deals.

If we want to be a big club we need more very competent people at all levels. Attempting to run lean would be a mistake. You don't get the best out of people by overworking them (except very occasionally in short bursts).

If people think that a DoF is negotiating deals - they’re very wrong. Blues have 50% of transfers from two agencies in the last 18 months. There’s a reason for that.

What is the reason?

LondonBlue

Fat Buddha OBE

Sheep2

I was thinking more of assistants coming in below him or alongside at most, not above.
That is if he stays.

I think it would be an issue anyway whoever is director of football. . I'm not sure how bigger clubs do it, but Liverpool must have had different people working on the multiple transfers last Summer with the top team supervising rather than trying to negotiate all the deals.

If we want to be a big club we need more very competent people at all levels. Attempting to run lean would be a mistake. You don't get the best out of people by overworking them (except very occasionally in short bursts).

If people think that a DoF is negotiating deals - they’re very wrong. Blues have 50% of transfers from two agencies in the last 18 months. There’s a reason for that.

What is the reason?

He wont tell you, its the SHA way.

El Mayor

LondonBlue

Fat Buddha OBE

Sheep2

I was thinking more of assistants coming in below him or alongside at most, not above.
That is if he stays.

I think it would be an issue anyway whoever is director of football. . I'm not sure how bigger clubs do it, but Liverpool must have had different people working on the multiple transfers last Summer with the top team supervising rather than trying to negotiate all the deals.

If we want to be a big club we need more very competent people at all levels. Attempting to run lean would be a mistake. You don't get the best out of people by overworking them (except very occasionally in short bursts).

If people think that a DoF is negotiating deals - they’re very wrong. Blues have 50% of transfers from two agencies in the last 18 months. There’s a reason for that.

What is the reason?

He wont tell you, its the SHA way.

It’s well known Gardner likes to do business with CAA Stellar and we do sign a lot of players who use their services.

In fairness they’re a huge agency so there are a lot of players signed to them.

Not sure who the other agency is, but I’m guessing the reason we do business with them is Gardner has a good rapport with them (like with Gordon Greer at Brighton and Darren Fletcher at Man U).

Tbh, it’s the way the world works; it’s easier to do business with people you know and you like than those you don’t.

El Mayor

LondonBlue

Fat Buddha OBE

Sheep2

I was thinking more of assistants coming in below him or alongside at most, not above.
That is if he stays.

I think it would be an issue anyway whoever is director of football. . I'm not sure how bigger clubs do it, but Liverpool must have had different people working on the multiple transfers last Summer with the top team supervising rather than trying to negotiate all the deals.

If we want to be a big club we need more very competent people at all levels. Attempting to run lean would be a mistake. You don't get the best out of people by overworking them (except very occasionally in short bursts).

If people think that a DoF is negotiating deals - they’re very wrong. Blues have 50% of transfers from two agencies in the last 18 months. There’s a reason for that.

What is the reason?

He wont tell you, its the SHA way.

It’s well known Gardner likes to do business with CAA Stellar and we do sign a lot of players who use their services.

In fairness they’re a huge agency so there are a lot of players signed to them.

Not sure who the other agency is, but I’m guessing the reason we do business with them is Gardner has a good rapport with them (like with Gordon Greer at Brighton and Darren Fletcher at Man U).

Tbh, it’s the way the world works; it’s easier to do business with people you know and you like than those you don’t.

Bartley Blues

El Mayor

Gavlaaa40

Sheep2

I was thinking more of assistants coming in below him or alongside at most, not above.
That is if he stays.

I think it would be an issue anyway whoever is director of football. . I'm not sure how bigger clubs do it, but Liverpool must have had different people working on the multiple transfers last Summer with the top team supervising rather than trying to negotiate all the deals.

If we want to be a big club we need more very competent people at all levels. Attempting to run lean would be a mistake. You don't get the best out of people by overworking them (except very occasionally in short bursts).

Genuinely not sure if he does a good job or not but this thread has led me down a rabbit hole looking at how we set up behind the scenes and it appears as though the 2 men who would be closer to transfers than CG are Joe Carnell (head of recruitment) who directs the day-to-day scouting infrastructure and analytical profiling of transfer targets & Steve Spencer (Head of first team recruitment) who coordinates the statistical model for assessing incoming players, both descriptions have been lifted from Google.

For reference CGs role is described as this "oversees the club's overarching football strategy, data-led talent acquisition, and performance departments".

He has been DoF for nearly 18 months now and in that time we have achieved cat 1 status at the Academy, won League 1 and achieved our best league finish in over a decade, would any of that happened without him? probably yes, but it still happened with him at the club so you have to give some credit to him for that.

There are obvious issues within the club that need fixing, i read earlier in the thread that you need to give a DoF 3-5 years before you can truly judge their performance as a whole and if CG goes i would assume more changes would follow as you would still have those directly below him doing the same jobs and we would still be using the same data software that we currently do, presumably if the club decides they want him to go they will want to revamp it all, basically there are many more layers to this than i first thought.

There are no simple answers. Ever.

I know he’s not everyone’s cup of tea, but personally I feel like he can go with his head held high.
From overseeing the 3 year plan of re structuring the player squad and contracts under the previous owners.
The influence he had in bringing Knighthead to the club and then leading the transformation under them.
I guess we won’t know the reasons for his removal/moving on but wanting better shouldn’t distract from his role over recent years in my eyes.

newblue

Bartley Blues

El Mayor

Gavlaaa40

Sheep2

I was thinking more of assistants coming in below him or alongside at most, not above.
That is if he stays.

I think it would be an issue anyway whoever is director of football. . I'm not sure how bigger clubs do it, but Liverpool must have had different people working on the multiple transfers last Summer with the top team supervising rather than trying to negotiate all the deals.

If we want to be a big club we need more very competent people at all levels. Attempting to run lean would be a mistake. You don't get the best out of people by overworking them (except very occasionally in short bursts).

Genuinely not sure if he does a good job or not but this thread has led me down a rabbit hole looking at how we set up behind the scenes and it appears as though the 2 men who would be closer to transfers than CG are Joe Carnell (head of recruitment) who directs the day-to-day scouting infrastructure and analytical profiling of transfer targets & Steve Spencer (Head of first team recruitment) who coordinates the statistical model for assessing incoming players, both descriptions have been lifted from Google.

For reference CGs role is described as this "oversees the club's overarching football strategy, data-led talent acquisition, and performance departments".

He has been DoF for nearly 18 months now and in that time we have achieved cat 1 status at the Academy, won League 1 and achieved our best league finish in over a decade, would any of that happened without him? probably yes, but it still happened with him at the club so you have to give some credit to him for that.

There are obvious issues within the club that need fixing, i read earlier in the thread that you need to give a DoF 3-5 years before you can truly judge their performance as a whole and if CG goes i would assume more changes would follow as you would still have those directly below him doing the same jobs and we would still be using the same data software that we currently do, presumably if the club decides they want him to go they will want to revamp it all, basically there are many more layers to this than i first thought.

There are no simple answers. Ever.

I know he’s not everyone’s cup of tea, but personally I feel like he can go with his head held high.
From overseeing the 3 year plan of re structuring the player squad and contracts under the previous owners.
The influence he had in bringing Knighthead to the club and then leading the transformation under them.
I guess we won’t know the reasons for his removal/moving on but wanting better shouldn’t distract from his role over recent years in my eyes.

For what people get paid (and despite why I say, if he was as influential as people say well done to him) we aren’t really that demanding in terms of success- there’s quite a lot of basic errors been made in both short and long term objectives. Fans who are long way from being insiders can see what issues should have been addressed which seem to still sit in the ‘in tray’.

Fat Buddha OBE

Sheep2

I was thinking more of assistants coming in below him or alongside at most, not above.
That is if he stays.

I think it would be an issue anyway whoever is director of football. . I'm not sure how bigger clubs do it, but Liverpool must have had different people working on the multiple transfers last Summer with the top team supervising rather than trying to negotiate all the deals.

If we want to be a big club we need more very competent people at all levels. Attempting to run lean would be a mistake. You don't get the best out of people by overworking them (except very occasionally in short bursts).

If people think that a DoF is negotiating deals - they’re very wrong. Blues have 50% of transfers from two agencies in the last 18 months. There’s a reason for that.

What is the reason?

Le Mod

I don’t dislike Gardner

But KH have been here for 3 full years now and given the resources we shouldn’t be seeing such big issues with the academy, with the pathway, with the culture, with the recruitment and the lack of joined up thinking that exists throughout the ‘football operation’

It won’t be all his fault and KH undoubtedly need to cede some control to football people, but a change can’t come as a surprise, something has to give eventually.

Tbh no DoF worth their salt should have allowed the Rooney thing to happen, it set us back hugely, cost us an absolute fortune and was a ridiculous decision.

Le Mod

It wasn’t his pick or his call but he’s Director of Football and it should never have happened, it was a catastrophic football decision. By all of the accounts I’ve been told, he didn’t do anything to stop it and just went along with it, if he can’t speak truth to power then there’s no real point having a DoF. KH not listening or delegating is another (linked) matter.

We’ll see what happens, I think we need better, I think we need better than Rigg too, and we need the ownership to trust the football people once appointed.