09:12, Tue 12 Feb
StechyBlue
Surely fine's hurt the board more than points deductions? They only hurts us the fans and the players/ management team who are being stripped of 12 points they've worked for.

It doesn't make any sense to me.
If there are no points deductions, then Billionaire Owned Club A can just spend £500m on buying promotion, and the owners pay the resulting fine out of their spare change.

If they're deducted enough points to prevent promotion, then the penalty has some teeth.

Plus, Pauper Owned Club B denied promotion by Cheating Club A does after all get the promotion they deserve.
09:16, Tue 12 Feb
Yep, exactly.
09:31, Tue 12 Feb
Whilst I agree with your analysis Dan (ie the board not playing ball being as much of an annoyance to the EFL as the club's accounts), I have to say to be pushing for 12 points seems too much.
I hope you're right, because if so I think we will get the sanction reduced. 12 is too much because they are pissed off with an individual.
Perhaps 6-8 points will be the outcome.
09:39, Tue 12 Feb
This has always been (one part of) my argument.

To say that the EFL are looking to screw us because we annoyed them - if true, makes them look petty, unprofessional and driven by temper rather than reason.

The EFL struggles with credibility as it is - to put it mildly - and this kind of suggested vindictive overkill would make them look like even bigger idiots...if that were possible.

Any punishment must be proportionate and just to stand up.

As I have said many times, if the punishment were 12 points I would be amazed - and doubly amazed if it was upheld.
10:15, Tue 12 Feb
If I understand it the League can't screw us because it's not the League making the decision - it is the independent arbitral panel.

It is however a very bad look for the League to ask for a higher penalty because they want to send a message to Ren Xuandong. How could we ever take any League ruling on anything (red cards for instance) seriously ever again? We could point to evidence of bias that makes it impossible for a fair decision.
11:24, Tue 12 Feb
Agree Spike. Can't see it being 12 really can't - that's what you get for going into admin, 6 would be more proportionate surely? and you are also correct that if it is 'revenge' driven then they really are a joke.
11:32, Tue 12 Feb
There's also the point that if you go into admin and take the 12 point penalty - doesn't that wipe out previous seasons' debts for FFP purposes? Not checked that though.
11:37, Tue 12 Feb
Well if the EFL have got as much communication from Ren that we have, no wonder they're pished off with us. Dan has been saying it for ages now but a lot of people seem to be dismissing it, and rather talk about why other clubs dont seem to be in the same position.
11:37, Tue 12 Feb
Not sure if that's been changed, but I know in the past it has...Leicester, Saints etc?
11:38, Tue 12 Feb
Fair enough, but it does seem harsh as emotionally it's just punishing us.
11:53, Tue 12 Feb
Spike
This has always been (one part of) my argument.

To say that the EFL are looking to screw us because we annoyed them - if true, makes them look petty, unprofessional and driven by temper rather than reason.

The EFL struggles with credibility as it is - to put it mildly - and this kind of suggested vindictive overkill would make them look like even bigger idiots...if that were possible.

Any punishment must be proportionate and just to stand up.

As I have said many times, if the punishment were 12 points I would be amazed - and doubly amazed if it was upheld.

I'm in a different position to you Spike; I can understand why the league are throwing the book at us.

It's another thing whether the panel will uphold it or not, but I think the fact it's got that far indicates that despite Blues using some heavyweight lawyers the EFL think they have a strong case as the proposal of 12 points was communicated to all clubs on Friday.
11:58, Tue 12 Feb
Do you know which firm is representing us?
12:04, Tue 12 Feb
We signed a player, Pedersen, whilst under embargo, apparently. That is the thing that you say really gives them a hard on for us. Well, given that senior administrators at the club were removed from their positions, does that not open up the possibility that they were ultimately responsible for any failing in governance. Dong Ren didn't do the day to day admin did he? He wouldn't have a dog and bark himself.

We overspent, I think being critical of naivety is fair, but there seems to a lot of good going on at the club too.

One question? With new investment, if there are deals for sponsorship etc. must they be announced through HKSE?
12:04, Tue 12 Feb
Heard that yes. However, given the knowledge that other clubs have complained about us to the EFL, then it's totally in the league's interest to say 'look, we've listened to and you and asked for 12, etc'.
However, the fact they've communicated that doesn't say, to me at least, they are any more confident of getting it than if they had stayed silent.
Could be famous last words of course, but what the EFL says and does are often miles apart.
12:06, Tue 12 Feb
12 is mental. Absolutely Draconian.

What's the point in carrying on with the season?

I will give £100 to the charity of Andy's choosing if another club gets a deduction like this next season.
We deserve our club back

H-Bomb

"Oh Nikola Zigic"