I can’t think of any decent male pundits apart from one or two on the radio, same more or less goes for female pundits. Get rid of the useless twerps and there should be plenty of room for decent pundits whatever they have between the legs.
Punditry in other sports when it is good gives an insight into what it’s like and what it takes to play the game at the highest level. Don’t get much of that from any of the pundits, nor much in the way of tactical analysis which tells us something that isn’t blindingly obvious. That’s my take anyway. Don’t bother much with the pre/mid/post game chat and contributions within the game tend to depend more on whether the pundit/ci commentator is a decent communicator.
Onel HernandezOldhamJust checking Joe - are you insinuating that opinions can't be wrong?
An opinion can be flawed but it can only be wrong if it is not that person's opinion?
By virtue of it being their opinion it is right. It is not a question of the validity of their opinion but it being their opinion.
Isn't there quite a philosophical discussion on this.
The opinion is quite clearly flawed though, no debate about that.
Hmm. But if it's raining outside and I say that in my opinion the sun is shining, surely my opinion is wrong and not just flawed. Flawed means something has an imperfection or weakness. But to be of the opinion that it is sunny when it is in fact raining is just wrong, incorrect, untrue.
When Barton states that women don't understand the men's game purely because they're women I feel that cannot be a correct opinion because it is factually wrong as a statement. His opinion on men being eunuchs for disagreeing with him is also wrong, as many of us on here can attest.
But hey, that's just my opinion...
RagsFair play. I believe the term is hoisted by his own petard.
Except it isn't .... i used to think the same until a couple of years ago when Ron (i think it was) corrected me on here
[interestingliterature.com]#
Hoist in this sense means "to be blown up"
So you would say "Barton was hoist by his own petard" .... not "hoisted"
.... as i say, i got it wrong for over 50 years so not being overly pedantic - just thought you may be interested
I am indeed interested. Cheers, Rags. 👍
OldhamJust checking Joe - are you insinuating that opinions can't be wrong?
To be honest, yes I am insinuating that because someone's opinion isn't a matter of fact 🤷
So when does an opinion become correct? When enough people agree with that opinion? Or is it just when you agree with it?
If we are now saying people's opinions are wrong, then future conversation and discussions are pretty doomed.
Let's just let chatGPT takeover from now on then 👍
Llanon_joeSo when does an opinion become correct?
When somebody presents supporting evidence which proves it to be fact. If they don't present this evidence or they offer evidence but it doesn't prove the point, then it's still just an opinion. As the person didn't offer any evidence in this case then their opinion of Barton's opinion is just another opinion.
I don't know if you've ever seen a list like this before -
[changingminds.org]
In one of Barton's tweets, he replies to somebody with the argument something along the lines of 'more managers who used to be players are employed as managers than those who didn't play' with the implication that this must prove that those who manage now but also played are better at the job. This is the 'appeal to majority' or 'common belief' fallacy IE because more clubs believe managers who also played are better managers (hence they employ them), it must be true that they are. But many of them could be employing unconscious bias when doing so. Many of them could be plain wrong. The higher number of them just doesn't logically prove the point at all and his argument falls over at that point.
newblueOnel HernandezOldhamJust checking Joe - are you insinuating that opinions can't be wrong?
An opinion can be flawed but it can only be wrong if it is not that person's opinion?
By virtue of it being their opinion it is right. It is not a question of the validity of their opinion but it being their opinion.
Isn't there quite a philosophical discussion on this.
The opinion is quite clearly flawed though, no debate about that.
If it was your opinion that the world is flat, I’d suggest it would be more than ‘flawed’ and no amount of self accreditation would make it ‘right’.
The firmament shall never be breached, created by Christ himself
WR BlueLlanon_joeSo when does an opinion become correct?
When somebody presents supporting evidence which proves it to be fact. If they don't present this evidence or they offer evidence but it doesn't prove the point, then it's still just an opinion. As the person didn't offer any evidence in this case then their opinion of Barton's opinion is just another opinion.
I don't know if you've ever seen a list like this before -
[changingminds.org]
In one of Barton's tweets, he replies to somebody with the argument something along the lines of 'more managers who used to be players are employed as managers than those who didn't play' with the implication that this must prove that those who manage now but also played are better at the job. This is the 'appeal to majority' or 'common belief' fallacy IE because more clubs believe managers who also played are better managers (hence they employ them), it must be true that they are. But many of them could be employing unconscious bias when doing so. Many of them could be plain wrong. The higher number of them just doesn't logically prove the point at all and his argument falls over at that point.
No, I have never seen a list like that. But I like it 👍
I'll be saving that ready for my next word battle
It's a great website for learning all sorts of stuff (try the index on the home page) - ideal for when you're bored and want to do something a bit productive but don't know where to start. It leads you down the wonderful rabbit hole of critical thinking. But even the fallacies page is worth it's weight in gold on it's own and you can spend years on it - I have! 👍
Llanon_joeOldhamJust checking Joe - are you insinuating that opinions can't be wrong?
To be honest, yes I am insinuating that because someone's opinion isn't a matter of fact 🤷
So when does an opinion become correct? When enough people agree with that opinion? Or is it just when you agree with it?
If we are now saying people's opinions are wrong, then future conversation and discussions are pretty doomed.
Let's just let chatGPT takeover from now on then 👍
Well no. Some of us are suggesting that an opinion cannot override a fact. If you have an opinion that the earth is flat then your opinion is scientifically, factually incorrect.
You are still entitled to hold that opinion but it is an opinion that's core value is wrong.
Le ModMaking a conscious decision to go down the anti-woke grifter route, suspect we will see a YouTube channel and appearances on GB News.
Sadly there will be plenty of people who will fall for it and make it lucrative for him.
Seems like you were right. He's advertising that he's on talk tv tonight with Piers Morgan apparently.