RagsFor him and for Fulham this has been a hugely successful season. He has transition to a higher league than last year and actually improved his goal scoring record. He has had to play a demanding role week in week out. Fulham and Jay himself with have far better idea what he can become now and also what type of forward he is.
I agree that at times he is far too wasteful with his energy without the ball and then isn't necessarily sharp and disciplined enough when the ball is pushed forward to him isolated from the rest of the team. Simply put he isn't a lone striker, he isn't Clayton Donaldson who was a different level for us doing a similar job under the same manager.
I know, I know we didn't have the resource to bring in ANY proper centre forward for 2 whole seasons but the lack of options up front has killed us this season and that is not Jay's fault.
I agree with all of that .... and we/Fulham will have also noticed that he stays injury free and can take some hard knocks and get himself back up. He may be slight but he doesn't let himself be bullied.
I know we hate looking across the A38 for lessons, but Watkins has had a very successful spell at Villa and puts it all down to being told NOT to run around as much, not to chase back as much and not to run the channels.
The difference is, Watkins has that done for him, Stan doesn’t 9/10
Fat Buddha CBE FEAHow the hell he’s scored as many as he has in this team is miracle.
I only know about moneyball from the film but isn’t it about looking beyond the stats and data, looking at underlying, hidden factors that show a player is better than bald stats suggest? That’s how the Blooms and Benhams of this world snap up bargains. Who then go for megabucks.
I don’t think Stansfields stats are showing just how good he is
I've not seen the film so can't comment on the semi-fictionalised version but the actual real world Moneyball was 100% about using the stats. It wasn't hidden factors but rather working harder and smarter with the statistics than everyone else.
Fat Buddha CBE FEAHow the hell he’s scored as many as he has in this team is miracle.
I only know about moneyball from the film but isn’t it about looking beyond the stats and data, looking at underlying, hidden factors that show a player is better than bald stats suggest? That’s how the Blooms and Benhams of this world snap up bargains. Who then go for megabucks.
I don’t think Stansfields stats are showing just how good he is
I've not seen the film so can't comment on the semi-fictionalised version but the actual real world Moneyball was 100% about using the stats. It wasn't hidden factors but rather working harder and smarter with the statistics than everyone else.
Fair enough but what does working harder and smarter with the stats entail? Looking beyond the obvious?
Good film by the way. Very entertaining
Fat Buddha CBE FEAFat Buddha CBE FEAHow the hell he’s scored as many as he has in this team is miracle.
I only know about moneyball from the film but isn’t it about looking beyond the stats and data, looking at underlying, hidden factors that show a player is better than bald stats suggest? That’s how the Blooms and Benhams of this world snap up bargains. Who then go for megabucks.
I don’t think Stansfields stats are showing just how good he is
I've not seen the film so can't comment on the semi-fictionalised version but the actual real world Moneyball was 100% about using the stats. It wasn't hidden factors but rather working harder and smarter with the statistics than everyone else.
Fair enough but what does working harder and smarter with the stats entail? Looking beyond the obvious?
Good film by the way. Very entertaining
Yes - baseball scouting, like the NFL etc tended to focus on "key" metrics like sprint speed, arm strength etc. All the things thought to be needed to be a top player.
Moneyball looked at what metrics actually mattered from scratch, based on what matters in a game. So ignore sprint time and batting strength but look at how often the player made it to the 1st base etc
Basically, I think, identify the best players, while everyone else was identifying the best athletes (so you hopefully get a Miyoshi while everyone else gets a Chris Burke)
El MayorSuper HansThe stats are clearly flawed though. I don’t think anyone would say Stansfield is our 9th best player.
People are not going to like this, but I disagree.
People romanticise Stansfield cos he works hard, he scores goals and he’s a young lad.
However hard he works, there are many games where he has no impact and that is reflected in the stats. It’s all well and good chasing lost causes but if you don’t actually win any it’s not effective.
Chances missed like the one away to Huddersfield don’t help his stats either.
Stats this ... stats that .... numbers on paper. Some will say stats can be a load of bollocks !
All I know is if we had 11 players with Stansfield's attitude, work rate, determination and character consistently applying those attributes we wouldn't be in this relegation dog fight.
Fat Buddha CBE FEA[www.samford.edu]Fat Buddha CBE FEAHow the hell he’s scored as many as he has in this team is miracle.
I only know about moneyball from the film but isn’t it about looking beyond the stats and data, looking at underlying, hidden factors that show a player is better than bald stats suggest? That’s how the Blooms and Benhams of this world snap up bargains. Who then go for megabucks.
I don’t think Stansfields stats are showing just how good he is
I've not seen the film so can't comment on the semi-fictionalised version but the actual real world Moneyball was 100% about using the stats. It wasn't hidden factors but rather working harder and smarter with the statistics than everyone else.
Fair enough but what does working harder and smarter with the stats entail? Looking beyond the obvious?
Good film by the way. Very entertaining
Exactly that basically, teams before were too focused on batting average, and overlooked other less obvious but important stats.
generalBlueEl MayorSuper HansThe stats are clearly flawed though. I don’t think anyone would say Stansfield is our 9th best player.
People are not going to like this, but I disagree.
People romanticise Stansfield cos he works hard, he scores goals and he’s a young lad.
However hard he works, there are many games where he has no impact and that is reflected in the stats. It’s all well and good chasing lost causes but if you don’t actually win any it’s not effective.
Chances missed like the one away to Huddersfield don’t help his stats either.
Stats this ... stats that .... numbers on paper. Some will say stats can be a load of bollocks !
All I know is if we had 11 players with Stansfield's attitude, work rate, determination and character consistently applying those attributes we wouldn't be in this relegation dog fight.
I agree wholeheartedly that stats on their own only tell one side of the story.
Problem is all I see here from people arguing against them are their subjective opinions - which are influenced by their own perceptions and biases and as such aren’t the whole picture either.
Stats help us understand that our own perceptions could well be flawed and that there are things that we might have missed / overlooked.
Wagner’s DreamFat Buddha CBE FEA[www.samford.edu]Fat Buddha CBE FEAHow the hell he’s scored as many as he has in this team is miracle.
I only know about moneyball from the film but isn’t it about looking beyond the stats and data, looking at underlying, hidden factors that show a player is better than bald stats suggest? That’s how the Blooms and Benhams of this world snap up bargains. Who then go for megabucks.
I don’t think Stansfields stats are showing just how good he is
I've not seen the film so can't comment on the semi-fictionalised version but the actual real world Moneyball was 100% about using the stats. It wasn't hidden factors but rather working harder and smarter with the statistics than everyone else.
Fair enough but what does working harder and smarter with the stats entail? Looking beyond the obvious?
Good film by the way. Very entertaining
Exactly that basically, teams before were too focused on batting average, and overlooked other less obvious but important stats.
Sabremetrics are insane, some are more subjective than I’d like but they offer a deeper understanding. I’d love some bod to come up with a similar stat to WAR (wins above replacement) for football.
We could do with that level of analytical detail working on our throw ins.
That's valid.
I'd also argue that we're yet to see just how good a player Stansfield is, he's got huge potential to improve and I reckon that can be achieved in a relatively short space of time.
I tend to judge players on what I see week in week out.
Trust me when judging Stansfield it's not romanticising.
Our owners should try to sign him on a permanent as high priority or absolute minimum on another season long loan. If they achieve that then sign 2 number 9's and alternate their appearances to bring out the most of this kid's talent.
Fat Buddha CBE FEA
Yes - and since that was written they have been consistently one of the top sides in Denmark, which is evidence that the approach works if done well.
generalBlueThat's valid.
I'd also argue that we're yet to see just how good a player Stansfield is, he's got huge potential to improve and I reckon that can be achieved in a relatively short space of time.
I tend to judge players on what I see week in week out.
Trust me when judging Stansfield it's not romanticising.
Our owners should try to sign him on a permanent as high priority or absolute minimum on another season long loan. If they achieve that then sign 2 number 9's and alternate their appearances to bring out the most of this kid's talent.
Whatever the outcome on Saturday, I hope we find the time at the final whistle to give Stansfield a good ovation on what is highly likely to be his final game for us. There aren’t too many others who are going to be worthy of a show of appreciation at the end so hopefully we can show him his efforts over the season have been appreciated.
generalBlueThat's valid.
I'd also argue that we're yet to see just how good a player Stansfield is, he's got huge potential to improve and I reckon that can be achieved in a relatively short space of time.
I tend to judge players on what I see week in week out.
Trust me when judging Stansfield it's not romanticising.
Our owners should try to sign him on a permanent as high priority or absolute minimum on another season long loan. If they achieve that then sign 2 number 9's and alternate their appearances to bring out the most of this kid's talent.
Yes, we can that there's areas in which he can improve - ball control and passing at times. His aerial duels, holding onto the ball and passing are rated as 'weak'. Obviously he's never going to be Juke in the air, but I think that he other two aspects are noticeable at times. If you look beyond the bald stats though, you could perhaps suggest that he might be knackered for a good part of the game with his intense and impressive workrate, and maybe his desperation to keep the ball or hold it up when they're not necessarily anyone there to help him.
generalBlueEl MayorSuper HansThe stats are clearly flawed though. I don’t think anyone would say Stansfield is our 9th best player.
People are not going to like this, but I disagree.
People romanticise Stansfield cos he works hard, he scores goals and he’s a young lad.
However hard he works, there are many games where he has no impact and that is reflected in the stats. It’s all well and good chasing lost causes but if you don’t actually win any it’s not effective.
Chances missed like the one away to Huddersfield don’t help his stats either.
Stats this ... stats that .... numbers on paper. Some will say stats can be a load of bollocks !
All I know is if we had 11 players with Stansfield's attitude, work rate, determination and character consistently applying those attributes we wouldn't be in this relegation dog fight.
Absolutely this