I did wonder if part of the problem is Sanderson and Aiwu as our centre backs.
I think they are both fine individually. I'm less convinced they are a good pairing.
When Long was playing we were conceding a lot fewer goals. I appreciate he is slow for a side pushed higher up the pitch and we had more midfield cover, but I did wonder if we might be more solid with a different pairing at CB. I think Long organised the defence better. I am not sure we have a strong organise at the moment.
We have conceded a lot of goals recently. I put some of it down to the Sunjic shaped hole in midfield, but some of it seems down to not being well organised in defence.
Docky91QBBC2LondonBlue- we’ve just not got good enough quality. And that’s the players problem not the Clubs or Fans. How on earth do some of them think they’ll ever be good enough for a top Championship side I’ll never know.
The problem with it being ‘the players problem’ and then ‘not being good enough’ is the fact that before a brainless decision by the board these same players were 6th in the league.
Some questions for you:
Where do you think we would currently be in the table if JE was still at the helm?
How quickly do you think the playing style/consistency of performance would have improved if JE was given more time?
Do you suffer from neck pain constantly looking backwards instead of forwards?
I think we would be at least 7th, he would have gotten 6 more points than Rooney has in this time and with the swing in GD and potential dropped points by Blackburn we’d be 7th. Actually scratch that, I think 6th as I think we’d also have gotten something against Hull.
I do not think we’re playing better football at all right now, and tbh I never even had an issue with Eustace, he utilised stand field in a far better way and that was beautiful to watch in itself, so that’s a nil point.
Well, the first premise of the thread was about our players not being good enough for this system, the only one to reference the inaccuracy of that is to point back, how else do you want me to that? Or should I just blindly agree with everything..
We would be 6th if we had won 2 extra games, that’s not the realms of fantasy, that’s fact (if hull was one of those games) under Eustace and what he showed I have every faith we would have.
Well the word ‘improved’ is definitely an indication of performance is it not? And it was a brainless decision by the owners, we had players that I believe could have gotten us into the playoffs under the system, and now mid table looks like an achievement and to get the better players for the system they want they will have to spend a lot of money, which we can’t do due to FFP. So yeah, brainless.
IMO opinion, if Rooney carries on as he is, which I sincerely hope he doesn’t, and goes, Cook has to go with him.
I don’t think Cooke should go on the back of the Rooney decision (if it doesn’t work out) because it was a coronation rather than a proper appointment. He will need to show next time that he can oversee a proper recruitment campaign for a new manager rather than another of his hand picked selections
Gardner should be picking the manager anyway, not Cook
Hallelujah and amen. Cook can count the beans but never let him pick another manager again.
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We would be 6th if we had won 2 extra games, that’s not the realms of fantasy, that’s fact (if hull was one of those games) under Eustace and what he showed I have every faith we would have.
Well the word ‘improved’ is definitely an indication of performance is it not? And it was a brainless decision by the owners, we had players that I believe could have gotten us into the playoffs under the system, and now mid table looks like an achievement and to get the better players for the system they want they will have to spend a lot of money, which we can’t do due to FFP. So yeah, brainless.
IMO opinion, if Rooney carries on as he is, which I sincerely hope he doesn’t, and goes, Cook has to go with him.
Not entirely sure your maths stacks up tbf but either way “if” is fantasy. The fact is that we didn’t win 2 extra games. Your faith in JE is also fantasy, not fact, as it can be just as easily argued that, based on past form, JE wouldn’t have won those games.
It’s difficult to compare or predict what would or wouldn’t have happened had JE still been in charge but if we look at how we fared against the same teams the previous season under JE, where applicable or, in the case of promoted/relegated teams, the teams who had the same or similar final league position the season before, then we get the following
Boro (A) JE lost 1-0 WR lost 1-0
Hull (H) JE lost 1-0 WR lost 2-0
S’hampton* (A) JE N/A WR lost 3-1 comparable JE game Norwich lost 3-1
Ipswich (H) JE N/A. WR drew 2-2 comparable JE game Rotherham won 2-0
Sund (A) JE lost 2-1 WR lost 3-1
Sheff W (H) JE N/A WR won 2-1 comparable JE game Sunderland - lost 2-1
B’burn (A) JE lost 2-1 WR lost 4-2
Based on that JE’s points tally would’ve been 3 and WR’s is 4 so we would have been 1 place lower than we are now but with a better goal difference. Nowhere near 6th though.
QBBC2]
We would be 6th if we had won 2 extra games, that’s not the realms of fantasy, that’s fact (if hull was one of those games) under Eustace and what he showed I have every faith we would have.
Well the word ‘improved’ is definitely an indication of performance is it not? And it was a brainless decision by the owners, we had players that I believe could have gotten us into the playoffs under the system, and now mid table looks like an achievement and to get the better players for the system they want they will have to spend a lot of money, which we can’t do due to FFP. So yeah, brainless.
IMO opinion, if Rooney carries on as he is, which I sincerely hope he doesn’t, and goes, Cook has to go with him.
Not entirely sure your maths stacks up tbf but either way “if” is fantasy. The fact is that we didn’t win 2 extra games. Your faith in JE is also fantasy, not fact, as it can be just as easily argued that, based on past form, JE wouldn’t have won those games.
It’s difficult to compare or predict what would or wouldn’t have happened had JE still been in charge but if we look at how we fared against the same teams the previous season under JE, where applicable or, in the case of promoted/relegated teams, the teams who had the same or similar final league position the season before, then we get the following
Boro (A) JE lost 1-0 WR lost 1-0
Hull (H) JE lost 1-0 WR lost 2-0
S’hampton* (A) JE N/A WR lost 3-1 comparable JE game Norwich lost 3-1
Ipswich (H) JE N/A. WR drew 2-2 comparable JE game Rotherham won 2-0
Sund (A) JE lost 2-1 WR lost 3-1
Sheff W (H) JE N/A WR won 2-1 comparable JE game Sunderland - lost 2-1
B’burn (A) JE lost 2-1 WR lost 4-2
Based on that JE’s points tally would’ve been 3 and WR’s is 4 so we would have been 1 place lower than we are now but with a better goal difference. Nowhere near 6th though.
For arguments sake, How about comparing the Ipswich result to Leeds one which we won and Sheff Wed to Plymouth Which we won also another 6 points and closer to table positions, much fairer comparison than Ipswich and Rotherham and Sheff Wed and Sunderland to fit your needs and also based on this seasons results
QBBC2]
We would be 6th if we had won 2 extra games, that’s not the realms of fantasy, that’s fact (if hull was one of those games) under Eustace and what he showed I have every faith we would have.
Well the word ‘improved’ is definitely an indication of performance is it not? And it was a brainless decision by the owners, we had players that I believe could have gotten us into the playoffs under the system, and now mid table looks like an achievement and to get the better players for the system they want they will have to spend a lot of money, which we can’t do due to FFP. So yeah, brainless.
IMO opinion, if Rooney carries on as he is, which I sincerely hope he doesn’t, and goes, Cook has to go with him.
Not entirely sure your maths stacks up tbf but either way “if” is fantasy. The fact is that we didn’t win 2 extra games. Your faith in JE is also fantasy, not fact, as it can be just as easily argued that, based on past form, JE wouldn’t have won those games.
It’s difficult to compare or predict what would or wouldn’t have happened had JE still been in charge but if we look at how we fared against the same teams the previous season under JE, where applicable or, in the case of promoted/relegated teams, the teams who had the same or similar final league position the season before, then we get the following
Boro (A) JE lost 1-0 WR lost 1-0
Hull (H) JE lost 1-0 WR lost 2-0
S’hampton* (A) JE N/A WR lost 3-1 comparable JE game Norwich lost 3-1
Ipswich (H) JE N/A. WR drew 2-2 comparable JE game Rotherham won 2-0
Sund (A) JE lost 2-1 WR lost 3-1
Sheff W (H) JE N/A WR won 2-1 comparable JE game Sunderland - lost 2-1
B’burn (A) JE lost 2-1 WR lost 4-2
Based on that JE’s points tally would’ve been 3 and WR’s is 4 so we would have been 1 place lower than we are now but with a better goal difference. Nowhere near 6th though.
Ok so first thing.
My maths does stack up, please prove otherwise if you wanna make a comment like that, an extra 6 points (including beating hull or at least not losing) would put us 6th or 7th. (Depending on GD and also the Blackburn result)
Now secondly, you are really really clutching at stats & comparison there it’s embarrassing.
Let’s just take Eustaces 1.6 points per game average this season which over the 7 games Rooney has faced has given us 4 points, Eustace would have gotten 11.
Now you may say, ‘but look at us playing the top 6 blah blah blah’
Well in the only 2 games JE played against the current top 6 we won both of them, being West Brom and Leeds.
So please, please explain to me why I’m off on this? I’m dying to hear it.
Rooney has managed a whopping 0,56 PPG. The extra 11 points accumulated by JE may just be enough to see us clear of the relegation dogfight.
foghorn leghornHallelujah and amen. Cook can count the beans but never let him pick another manager again.
Ok that’s fine with me also, but yeah Cook can never ever pick a manager, it’s not like we had a vacant position and he made the wrong hire.
He actively sacked a good manager for one that is seemingly a bad one. All trust should be gone.
Given the momentum & continuity after wba and huddersfield i don't see how anyone could say we couldn't
have at least 5 more points than we do now? One win at home on its own is 3 points eg Hull
and a couple of draws from the others
We should be just off the playoffs with cardiff Bburn and pne
Not saying we would keep it up but i for one was looking forward to an enjoyable top 10-12 season
Like last year after our good start?
We are changing our culture massively from being "difficult to beat" and "competitive" to one that is on the front foot and progressive.
I.e we can't concede if we keep the ball or they can't get close to our goal because we've pressed and penned them into their own half instead of playing a low block.
Problem is right now we don't quite the keep ball well enough or engage in the press together which is why at times we look so open. But it is something we will improve at either with the players we have because they've learned or with new players because the current ones couldn't adapt.
We are starting to see who can and can't do it and they aren't really any shocks in either camp although maybe I thought Bielik wouldn't be struggling like he is.
I've always found that when watching man city, they look susceptible to every teams attack once that first press is beaten. It just doesn't happen very often because they are so good at the press/they've worn down the opposition enough that they are unable to capitalise on the few opportunities they get. We just get played through 4 or 5 times a game as opposed to 1 for man city.
Tha Project OBELike last year after our good start?
Technically we was averaging less last year ppg than this year after 11 games and even then got another 12 points after the 7. It was the Xmas period we suffered
Everbluesince92We are changing our culture massively from being "difficult to beat" and "competitive" to one that is on the front foot and progressive.
I.e we can't concede if we keep the ball or they can't get close to our goal because we've pressed and penned them into their own half instead of playing a low block.
Problem is right now we don't quite the keep ball well enough or engage in the press together which is why at times we look so open. But it is something we will improve at either with the players we have because they've learned or with new players because the current ones couldn't adapt.
We are starting to see who can and can't do it and they aren't really any shocks in either camp although maybe I thought Bielik wouldn't be struggling like he is.
I've always found that when watching man city, they look susceptible to every teams attack once that first press is beaten. It just doesn't happen very often because they are so good at the press/they've worn down the opposition enough that they are unable to capitalise on the few opportunities they get. We just get played through 4 or 5 times a game as opposed to 1 for man city.
Well if we’re quoting previous posters and talking about fact and fiction.
We’re not changing our culture, you’re ‘hoping’ we are going to change our culture. All we have succeeded in thus far is going from ‘competitive’ and ‘difficult to beat’ to ‘uncompetitive’ and ‘easy to beat’
Plenty have teams have tried to make this adjustment; particularly in the premier league, and more often than not it fails and they get relegated.
You should never ever try to change the culture of a football team in one fell swoop it needs to be gradual and over time, this is the difference between the likes of Brentford and Brighton to the likes of Bournemouth and West Brom. These teams that have survived a certain way and suddenly get these delusions of grandeur to being the next attractive football team, only to be relegated. Just because they try and change too quickly.
There was a comment in the original post about the ‘problem’ being the players, imo they are the least of the problem and they have been treated most unfairly of all, these players signed contracts, deals or loans on the basis of playing for a certain manager in a certain way, under the presumption, as we all have in our working life, that if you perform well you will be ok, and they upheld their end of the bargain, and then all of a sudden the rug was pulled under their feet, and now people wanna blame them? In what world is that remotely fair?