ThongsThey’re probably just WUMs. I hate that, WUMs kill this forum.
Tom TheProject BradySuper HansYou can’t compare the two after 11 games, you have to give WR this season and all of next summer.
But the purpose of appointing him wasn't an experimental, empirical exercise in working out which is the better manager, it was to take us forward.
I don't remember them saying obvious on-field progress was going to happen immediately?
They obviously see an eventual higher ceiling with WR than they did with JE
Kind of implicit in any managerial appointment though isn't it? You don't appoint a new manager with the intention of being worse or no better than you already are. And in any case, they sort of did with the 'no fear' soundbites didn't they?
Tom TheProject BradySuper HansYou can’t compare the two after 11 games, you have to give WR this season and all of next summer.
But the purpose of appointing him wasn't an experimental, empirical exercise in working out which is the better manager, it was to take us forward.
I don't remember them saying obvious on-field progress was going to happen immediately?
They obviously see an eventual higher ceiling with WR than they did with JE
That’s the salient point.
The short termism expressed by quite a few is absolutely mystifying.
11 years of tortuous ownership has been consigned to miserable history and still people are only prepared to look at 6 or 11 results under serious businessmen who every single day are bringing this club back to life.
WTF !!
Sounds like last night was fantastic in terms of not only PR, but hopefully repairing some of the fractures within the fanbase. Hopefully now, with the win the weekend, the positivity and excitement about last night and a few more results in the next few weeks and we can get everyone together, the stadium full again and really start to push on.
The Devlin DisguiseSuper HansRooney needs next summer where we’re free from the financial shackles to sign players for the system and also to have a full pre season with him.
If we’re not seeing progress on the pitch by the start of next season then it’s going to be worrying.
He won't get it in the hypothetical event we're looking like going down though surely? Unless we were determined to let history repeat itself as tragedy. I think if we stick about where we are now then fine.
I'd agree with you there....results will determine what happens.
We probably need about 24 more points to stay up (maybe a few less), so 6 wins and 6 draws from 29 games. Even with how poor we've looked under Rooney so far I can't see us not achieving that.
David XavisSounds like last night was fantastic in terms of not only PR, but hopefully repairing some of the fractures within the fanbase. Hopefully now, with the win the weekend, the positivity and excitement about last night and a few more results in the next few weeks and we can get everyone together, the stadium full again and really start to push on.
Exactly that. I'm struggling to understand why people are surprised that things are a bit flat when a new manager who most people didn't think we needed in the first place comes in and gets 1 point out of 15. It was always the risk, and surely they priced this in to their decision (though the bits people have been saying from last night sound like they've been oddly caught by surprise by the reaction). If we start playing better - Ipswich for 60 mins, a fair bit of the second half on Saturday - all but the most negative will be on board.
IanTThe Devlin DisguiseSuper HansRooney needs next summer where we’re free from the financial shackles to sign players for the system and also to have a full pre season with him.
If we’re not seeing progress on the pitch by the start of next season then it’s going to be worrying.
He won't get it in the hypothetical event we're looking like going down though surely? Unless we were determined to let history repeat itself as tragedy. I think if we stick about where we are now then fine.
I'd agree with you there....results will determine what happens.
We probably need about 24 more points to stay up (maybe a few less), so 6 wins and 6 draws from 29 games. Even with how poor we've looked under Rooney so far I can't see us not achieving that.
I think that's right. The difficulty with these things is that results aren't evenly spread - last season being a prime example, where we started pretty well then had a spell where it looked like we couldn't buy a win. We were realistically safe in Feb/March, but you can't help looking over your shoulder (especially with our past performance these last few seasons). That's where it might get difficult.
It's not totally implausible that we go and win tomorrow night, manage that the positive going into the weekend ends up being huge. Just shows how fickle football can be.
The Devlin DisguiseI don’t think anyone has claimed to be ‘in rapture over Rooney’ but will support him and his appointment. I see that as being ‘the norm’ when it comes to mindsets.Tilton RifleThat 30% can't look ahead. They need immediate proof. So win the next two games and they're on side. I'm interested in what the missing 10% think.
The current ownership is light years ahead of anything we've had before. Time for everyone to get onboard.
Surely it can be possible to be on board with most of what they've done, be excited about what they said last night and be grateful we're light years away from the last owners (probably the best we've ever had?) - but still be sceptical/underwhelmed/a bit depressed about the managerial saga. I don't see that as negative. I'd say it's well over 30% of the fanbase that think along those lines from my conversations with people, and judging from the atmosphere in the ground. If a third of the fan base was in rapture about Rooney there'd be a lot better atmosphere than there has been so far.
The binary on here between outright hostility and an ask for uncritical support is a bit strange. And I don't think that 33/33/33 thing really helps in the context of fans - it's basically 'f*&$ of down Villa Park then' but using percentages to sound clever.
In the end you're basically right - a few good results and it will all improve and all this will be forgotten. It was ever thus. It's been a big, some say needless, change when most were just content to be where we were after the best part of a decade of trauma. Some people just need time to get their heads around it and let it bed in.
I’ve been hailed ass one backing him blind, but weirdly U may have been the first to criticise him saying he was changing style after talking to the players and realising they were uncomfortable trying to pass the ball more. I still went to Southampton the following game and didn’t get on their backs though. It really is quite simple
chapeau to the senior management team last night, was an excellent, informative event. Great news they are restarting the supporters clubs & sense of togetherness. Standout for me was the community work & the headmaster from the school in Frankley was inspirational. Another take out was the staff, they couldn't have been more friendly or helpful, everyone from the security chaps to the receptionists to the BCFC staff,credit to the club. We are very lucky to have this management team on board. Also nodd to Craig Gardner who was excellent.
WR BlueBluesince62We have to give it more time for starters. This is a long haul job.
You've half answered the question yourself...FFP means we can't just do a vile or dingles and cheat the system (those loopholes are gone) and buy an all singing, dancing, Brazil lite squad in one window.
We've got dead wood to replace and income to raise, I think you are looking at 2 windows minimum before it'll start taking shape.
We're 6 games in, I hope the patience message gets across to a few more because it's needed. The future looks great, if people can look a bit further than 6 games.
ClaptonI haven’t heard much of what was discussed but someone I know who was present said Rooney, really impressed him with his footballing knowledge.
This is from someone that wasn’t a fan of Rooney, whatsoever. He was strongly behind JE.
If Rooney, is able to turn him around he can turn the other doubters too.
El MayorIt was really good. He’s a different animal off camera and not on the spot. No erms, no hesitation; his stuff made sense although the fact we beat Wednesday at the weekend probably helped.
I suspect some wouldn’t accept it regardless but I’m a believer now.
newblueWhether you believe that what is being aimed for is realistic and achievable, or are sceptical about it (‘it’s just corporate schmooze’) - or have a view somewhere in between - the difference what we had before and now can be measured in light years. I’d have thought that at the very least is to be appreciated.
Apparently though spending £12m of desperately needed investment in a short time is of little consequence. I don’t think it is and there is a pretty clear plan here for the first time in a long time.
All good points and certainly help this doubter to try and be quiet and patient for a while. I saw Cook's Q & A but didn't get to see the earlier stuff because the notification didn't arrive. I tuned in just as they announced the stadium tour. Hopefully they put the earlier recording up so we can see what was said by Wagner/Rooney etc.
WR fair play to you mate. There is a bit of faith involved, but I really believe under the owners we have now we are back on the up.
Doesn't mean you have to agree with everything they do (I certainly didn't agree with the WR appointment at the time) and if course there will be blips along the way.
We have gone from zero hope for years, to having real hope and seeing big changes for the better in a few short months.
All aboard!
Rab C NesbittThe Devlin DisguiseI don’t think anyone has claimed to be ‘in rapture over Rooney’ but will support him and his appointment. I see that as being ‘the norm’ when it comes to mindsets.Tilton RifleThat 30% can't look ahead. They need immediate proof. So win the next two games and they're on side. I'm interested in what the missing 10% think.
The current ownership is light years ahead of anything we've had before. Time for everyone to get onboard.
Surely it can be possible to be on board with most of what they've done, be excited about what they said last night and be grateful we're light years away from the last owners (probably the best we've ever had?) - but still be sceptical/underwhelmed/a bit depressed about the managerial saga. I don't see that as negative. I'd say it's well over 30% of the fanbase that think along those lines from my conversations with people, and judging from the atmosphere in the ground. If a third of the fan base was in rapture about Rooney there'd be a lot better atmosphere than there has been so far.
The binary on here between outright hostility and an ask for uncritical support is a bit strange. And I don't think that 33/33/33 thing really helps in the context of fans - it's basically 'f*&$ of down Villa Park then' but using percentages to sound clever.
In the end you're basically right - a few good results and it will all improve and all this will be forgotten. It was ever thus. It's been a big, some say needless, change when most were just content to be where we were after the best part of a decade of trauma. Some people just need time to get their heads around it and let it bed in.
I’ve been hailed ass one backing him blind, but weirdly U may have been the first to criticise him saying he was changing style after talking to the players and realising they were uncomfortable trying to pass the ball more. I still went to Southampton the following game and didn’t get on their backs though. It really is quite simple
I know - that's my point really. The majority position is probably cautiously 'seeing what happens'. So I just mean 1) this idea that a third of people see exactly what they are doing and buy into it is a bit false (as you say, it's more 'he's here now so we support him') and 2) this 'why can't everyone just get uncritically on the bus?' is a bit of an ask, and barking up the wrong tree as most people aren't being hostile/negative, but just a bit punch drunk and nonplussed by the whole thing. As I've said elsewhere, I'm convinced that will change pretty quickly if results and performances are good. And it won't if they aren't. That there's a bit of apprehension and negativity after a poor start is natural. But cautiously seeing what happens ≠ Fortress St Andrews / bear pit.
Is it safe to comment on this thread now without the maniacal ramblings of last night?!
TinaTractorIs it safe to comment on this thread now without the maniacal ramblings of last night?!
I don't see how these type of comments are going to contribute to maintaining positivity. If you have an issue with what somebody else has said, then by all means quote them and present a logical counter-argument to their points. That way we have a discussion.
Launching vague personal attacks against unidentified people who have commented within a thread is simply ramping up the toxicity level which so many are complaining about. What positive contribution do you have to offer? Let's hear it please.
If you feel the need to label somebody's comment as maniacal rambling then have the decency to point out who/what you are referring to and perhaps offer something of your own which you feel raises the bar.
