09:22, Wed 17 Nov
Bluewurst
Yes. It's not a contest of whose mental health was worse. It was bad for both of them. If Rafiq is lying about Ballance's considering he went through it himself, then that's not a great look. HTH.

If he’s lying about something like that it’s more than “not a good look” IMO. On any level

It’s amazing that peoples first post on this thread can be about Gary bloody Ballance. Amazing.
09:24, Wed 17 Nov
🤷🏻‍♂️
09:45, Wed 17 Nov
Yeah it’s something that was said when I played both cricket and football.

The Asian lads wouldn’t come to the club house or pub, and it was seen by some that they didn’t want to socialise or mates. It’s a cultural thing that people were taking personally rather than thinking of doing something to cater for all.
You’d never want to take away the tradition of having a beer with your mates but you should also think of being inclusive too and do something separately.
You shouldn’t have to forgo your own enjoyments to cater but you should certainly make an effort to appreciate why they may not want to do something
09:46, Wed 17 Nov
Lumbertubs
What do you have against sportsmen and women making a brief - but, hopefully, powerful - gesture (which ultimately makes no difference to your day) to show solidarity with a wider movement and to try to keep the focus on a problem which only the most closed-minded would argue doesn't exist in society?

Absolutely nothing.. but the suggestion was that all footballers and cricketers should be made to do it

I sincerely hope you'll think about why your responses in this thread are the way they are.

I do not know what you are getting at here...
23/01/20 Mad: I'll stop moaning now.
09:57, Wed 17 Nov
Agreed yeah.

You would like to think that people should realise that if you are all having a piss-up, and a Muslim lad doesn't want to come, it's not because he's being antisocial - it's just because it ain't the sort of thing he will want do do.

We had one lad in our team who was a Jehovah Witness, we had another who was a really devout Christian. We would always invite them - with a qualifier like "we know it's probably not your kind of thing but we don't want you to think you're not invited". Sometimes they might come along, have a soft drink or something and then go - other times they would just say no ta, not my kind of thing but enjoy yourselves.

We didn't think they were miserable, anti-social gits and feel offended...we took it for what it was. Not their thing.

Can't think I played with Muslim lads to be honest, my playing days were a long time ago, but it would have been dealt with the same.
10:02, Wed 17 Nov
Yeah it’s something that was said when I played both cricket and football.

The Asian lads wouldn’t come to the club house or pub, and it was seen by some that they didn’t want to socialise or mates. It’s a cultural thing that people were taking personally rather than thinking of doing something to cater for all.
You’d never want to take away the tradition of having a beer with your mates but you should also think of being inclusive too and do something separately.
You shouldn’t have to forgo your own enjoyments to cater but you should certainly make an effort to appreciate why they may not want to do something

To use a local example, Attock play at Moseley School and hire the pitch so the overheads aren't as onerous as others elsewhere. Lots of other cricket clubs rely heavily on the bar profits to stay afloat. Imagine how much less profitable Edgbaston would be if it was a dry stadium. It creates a tension, sadly.
10:10, Wed 17 Nov
I’ve read the full witness statement now. Balance is rightly getting hammered both on this thread and generally, and the stuff about Bresnan seems to have been drowned out a bit as a result. The Bresnan stuff is shocking.
10:12, Wed 17 Nov
Miss World
I’ve read the full witness statement now. Balance is rightly getting hammered both on this thread and generally, and the stuff about Bresnan seems to have been drowned out a bit as a result. The Bresnan stuff is shocking.

Is Ballance getting hammered on this thread? Seems a couple only want to focus on his potential health problems.

It saddens me about Bresnan though. As much as it does Hoggard.
10:13, Wed 17 Nov
Radavis
Miss World
I’ve read the full witness statement now. Balance is rightly getting hammered both on this thread and generally, and the stuff about Bresnan seems to have been drowned out a bit as a result. The Bresnan stuff is shocking.

Is Ballance getting hammered on this thread? Seems a couple only want to focus on his potential health problems.

It saddens me about Bresnan though. As much as it does Hoggard.

Agreed.

Re Ballance I just mean that there is far more focus on him than Bresnan.
10:15, Wed 17 Nov
👍🏽
Miss World
I’ve read the full witness statement now. Balance is rightly getting hammered both on this thread and generally, and the stuff about Bresnan seems to have been drowned out a bit as a result. The Bresnan stuff is shocking.

I read the full witness statement last night. It is absolutely horrendous to read it in full and understand the scale of what happened. In a way far worse than has been reported in the media. I’d suggest people take the time to read it.
10:29, Wed 17 Nov
Yeah the bar definitely makes the money
10:47, Wed 17 Nov
Yeah the bar definitely makes the money

For me, i think you want sports clubs of any description to cater for and make everyone want to come along. Most are still too focussed on male adult sport.

If you want women to go and play, you need to have changing rooms available, which is not always an easy fix.
Catering needs to be moved further away from mainly beer, bacon sandwiches and hot dogs. Etc, etc.
You want it to be an environment where your kids and all their friends can feel welcome.

That's going to take leadership and resource from the Governing body, because most of these places are run by older volunteers who will do what they have always done to keep their club going.

I can't think of any sport that can honestly put their hands up and say this is a game for everyone, and everyone's team and participation gets equal billing. Don't even start me on going down the Blues.
mad
10:47, Wed 17 Nov
There is still a heads in the sand mindset up at Yorkshire over this - and more widely as we can see and perhaps I'm complacent too about how I expect Warks will be affected

Sure there are bound to be elements of this at all sports and workplace cultures, christ imagine what the old Longbridge and Drews Lane factory workers were like, not to mention the forces - but the unique culture at Yorkshire has been very concerning for some time and if Bresnan has been involved heavily in all this (which seems likely) it is sad but reflects that culture. I imagine the stuff Bressy was engaging in he quite possibly genuinely saw it as soft male banter compared to stuff he'd seen growing up in West Yorkshire in the mid 1990's I remember the "NF" and "whites only" banners when we went to Elland Road for the FA Cup lost 3-2 when Ndlovu scored twice so we're not talking all that long ago. The problem is he then went through the system at Yorkshire in the late 90's as a kid and then the early 2000's where it was not stamped out but rather it was encouraged by coaches, physio's and senior players - a warped way to get the maximum out of atheletes in training - get them to The Edge. Kissing the badge up there "the white rose" seems to have taken on sinister connotations at least in a clique of the dressing room over a period of time
11:05, Wed 17 Nov
Yep it definitely needs to be a bit more diverse. But I think there’s a genuine concern for some , misplaced or not, that to achieve diversity you need to remove bits of life you’ve enjoyed ( Beer, bacon etc) to accommodate others. When they believe other cultures should accept their culture too.

It’s almost like a who blinks first type of scenario for some

Personally in an ideal world venues should cater for everyone and people should be accepting of each other

But I can’t see it happening Sadly